“Weirdo ideological reasons” such as belief in equality of opportunities, belief in universal free education, healthcare and pensions, belief in worker rights or belief in the right to housing and of employment. Those weird to you?

Give me a historical example of properly functioning, regulated capitalism

Again: what part of my second paragraph of the previous comment is a Russian talking point. If it’s so obvious you can definitely explain?

“You disagree with my point of view, so I’m not gonna respond to any of your arguments because my state propaganda told me your point of view is forbidden and ontologically evil and I can automatically discard any discussion about it. Yes, I’m the one whose opinion is founded on logic”

Please explain me how my concerns about the far right rising (arguably pro-russian) and the worries about the welfare state in Europe and my support for a EU-wide military alliance are Russian talking points.

Capitalism with controls is great

Please, can you give me the historical example you’re thinking about when you say this?

What we’ve got now looks more like a corporate oligarchy. The free market only applies to small players

Tell me, how free was India to develop in free competition against England in the 19th century? How free was Congo to compete against Belgium? Oh, wait, you’re only talking for a white minority, I see. When exactly was capitalism better, when English children lost their fingers trapped in machinery in coal-powered factories in England in the 1850s and died at 30-ish years of age? Maybe it was better in 1917, when the ambitions of capitalism and imperialism triggered WW1 and ground tens of millions of lives? Or was it good in the 1950s/60s when the US murdered millions in Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia and Korea through the most horrific bombing campaigns just because they didn’t want to be capitalist? What good capitalism are you exactly talking about?

Huh, what an ignorant peasant. Thou proclaimeth that thou doeth not like toiling away all thine day in the fields under the scorching sun and giving most of the produce as tributes to thine lord. But, thou use the protection of the lord. Hypocrisy, I tells thou

The antagonism between Ukrainians and Russians is a project the west has been pushing for a century. First it was Nazi Germany weaponizing a hunger episode that hurt Ukraine disproportionately more in order to create anti-russian sentiment (see Stepan Bandera), then it was Europe+US talking of Ukraine as a Russian colony during Soviet times.

In the 1991 referendum, Ukraine voted to remain part of the Soviet Union which was illegally dismantled against the democratic will of the majority of the Soviet population. Despite this, the country was dissolved, the economy was auctioned to the most corrupt bidder, the industry was dismantled, and by 2022 Ukraine still hadn’t recovered the economic level it had before 1991. The dissolution of the Soviet Union literally caused a demographic crisis in Ukraine comparable to the ongoing war.

Until 1991, the tensions between Ukraine and Russia were minor and the countries had a benign, sisterly relationship. It is the breaking of the eastern block that primarily triggers anti-russian nationalism in Ukraine and vice versa in Russia. It’s the broken promise of the west not to push NATO eastward that puts Russia on its toes, and it’s western-backed colour revolutions like the Euromaidan that proved Russia that Europe would always position itself against Russia, and not establishing friendly economic and diplomatic ties.

There’s no requirement for spending as a part of NATO.

Not a strict requirement, but pressure to do so. Whose idea was it to raise to 5% again? The only president who rejected the idea, Pedro Sanchez from Spain, got threatened with tariffs if Spain doesn’t conform.

They have reasons. Some EU nations are former Soviet states. Just the “restore the former borders of the Soviet union” reason is reason enough

Russia has been pushing for closer political and economic ties with Europe for the past 30 years. Russia was promised that if they dismantled the communist project NATO would cease to expand eastward, and NATO kept expanding eastward regardless. Turns out NATO was never about defending Europe (because it never has), it was always about creating tensions between Russia and Europe because a continuous political alliance of industrialized nations that spans from Gibraltar to Bering would be too powerful for the US to control.

The invasion of Ukraine by Russia is almost certainly the reason your country, whichever it is, is increasing military spending.

The justification is the invasion of Ukraine. But as a European, the number of times our military has been used to defend Europe has been 0 since WW2, it’s only ever used to support US imperial ambitions, to bomb brown children, or to keep control over colonies in Africa. Europe deals so much fucking damage with its imperialism, that’s one of the biggest reasons I don’t want military expenditure. They tell us it’s to defend from “le evil Ruzzians” but 5 years later Europe will be bombing brown children with that money, mark my words. For fuck’s sake Europe can’t even stop supporting the genocide of Palestinians. How can you want Europe to spend more money in military instead of engaging in diplomacy and not antagonising Russia?

Do they have the strength? Why is that included here. Does it matter?

It does matter. If Europe already has the military strength to repel Russia, why do you want the extra expenditure in weapons?

They are only useful to deter other nuclear strikes,

Why wasn’t the Soviet Union or any of its satellite states invaded by the west since they got the nukes, then? The cold war was raging, and yet there was no incident of overt military conflict between eastern and western block. How so?

I’d love to see the EU with its own defensive force

If love to see the EU pushing for diplomacy and not antagonising the largest country in the world which happens to be right beyond its borders. I would line to see a European military alliance independent from the US but I wouldn’t like it spending 5% of the yearly budget at the cost of already starving healthcare, education and pensions. Denmark already approved to raise retirement to 70 fucking years old in order to pay for this, Finland is pushing to remove holidays from the calendar, and England already said that raising this budget will have effects on expenditure in social services. This is absolute bullshit.

We have the far right getting stronger and stronger due to the worsening living conditions of Europeans because of austerity policy and lack of intervention of things like salaries or rent prices. Cool, let’s increase military expenditure to 5% right before fucking LePen, AfD, Vox and their equivalents get to the governments, what could possibly go wrong? Remember my words: in 5 years time, the European money will be spent not in conflict against Russia, but in middle east / Africa. Supporting military expenditure of the west is absolutely crazy.

You want magic, not reality. You want all the benefits of military power without any of the costs

No, I dont want the benefits of military power because I’m not a warmongering European chauvinist like you, I want the benefits of diplomacy, of social spending, and of good relations with neighbouring counteies. I don’t want my fucking healthcare money to end up in the pockets of Rheinmetall in order to lobby my politicians to go to war. I’m an able-bodied male and I don’t want my country to send me to be cannon fodder in the name of European imperialism.

First of all, the country currently forcing my country to cut expenditure in healthcare and to put it into military is the US, not Russia. And the country funding and arming the most flagrant example of genocide in the 21st century is the US.

Second of all, Russia doesn’t have geopolitical reasons, nor the military/economic strength, to invade EU countries. And even if it did, the EU has nukes so you don’t need further military expenditure as deterrent.

Third, even if you forget all I’ve said above, the EU can still have a military alliance without the US, and it would be a much better thing.

Western chauvinism makes non-whites 2nd class citizens. It’s a guise for enslaving the whole global south. Fuck western chauvinism. Defending it means you don’t value 80% of humans.

Capitalism can co-exist with socialism in the same economic system

Lemme guess: “socialism is when the government does stuff. And the more stuff it does, the more socialist it is. And when the government does a real lotta stuff, that’s communism”

Putin is famously the president of the Russian Republic, very different from the Soviet Union. I don’t know why you thinking me criticising what Russia has become somehow makes me Russian?

Sorry, mixed up grandpa and boss, hence the “the fact that you’re here”. The fact that you could have that conversation with your boss is because the Soviets gave everything to save him.

My grandfathers fought the Nazis in Europe and Japanese in the Pacific. A great uncle fought in Spain and in Germany against fascists both times

So all your family fought on the side of socialism against fascism and now you spit on their tomb by saying “socialism is just as bad”?

The Soviet Union was the most advanced and humane state of its time. Western Europe was murdering tens of millions through imperialism in the global south, the US had literal Jim Crow era laws against black people and was killing tens of millions through imperialism in Central/South America. If it weren’t for the fucking Bolsheviks, the entirety of Eastern Europe would have been genocided by Nazis and the few remaining people colonised, never to industrialise. The Soviet Union was the first country to guarantee truly universal healthcare, education and pensions, and only then did Europe have to follow through for fear of revolution. Highest unionisation rates in the world, abolished houselessness and unemployment. It certainly had flaws, but it’s literally the best it had to offer. For every Stalinist repression victim you quickly go dig up, I’ll show you ten Africans murdered by French/Belgians, or a hundred Indians murdered by British.

The death of NATO is a good fucking thing. No more US military bases in the EU, no more forced expenditure of civil budget in weapons causing austerity, no more bombing of Libya and Yugoslavia, no more US influence in European politics. If you’re European you should salivate at the thought of NATO ending.

The Soviet Union collapsing is what allowed the war in Ukraine. Do you see why rising military budgets in Europe doesn’t exactly promote peace?

Wait, “attack of evil”? The US is literally funding and arming the genocide in Gaza, the US IS the greatest evil. You may argue for Russia being a close second (discounting Israel), but how is the US not absolutely the worst by any metric? How many millions did it murder in Vietnam, Iraq, Korea, and how many millions more were murdered under its approval in Southeast Asia(Suharto) or Latin America (Pinochet)?

Maybe the fact that the left supports improved working rights, unionisation, free education, equality of opportunities and between nations, freer borders for people…

Spoken like a true chauvinist. The UK murdered tens of millions more in India alone under the guise of the values of enlightenment than Islam has in the past century and a half.

Please tell me, when exactly has capitalism been amazing?